The Anti Defamation League and the Council on American Islamic Relations have both reported an increase in anti-Semitic and Islamophobic harassment, respectively, in the wake of the horrific Hamas attack on Israel and the ongoing violence of Israel against Palestinians. [00:00:17] So let's start with the increase in Islamophobia and the hate crimes against Muslims, and then we'll discuss the ADL's reports on the increase in antisemitism as well. So this from AP. A spokesperson for the Council on American Islamic Relations said Wednesday [00:00:34] that the organization's chapters and national office had received 770 reports of bias related acts between October 7th and October 24. The national headquarters had 110 direct reports during that period, compared to 63 for all of August. [00:00:52] I'm sorry, 63 versus 110 direct reports versus 774 reports of bias. That is a massive increase. Now, of course, I don't think anyone has or could forget the brutal murder of a six year old Palestinian boy here in Illinois, [00:01:11] but I'll just remind anybody who either hasn't heard of this or needs reminding. The reported accidents October 7th include an Illinois landlord fatally stabbing a six-year-old Muslim boy and wounding the boy's mother, police say, [00:01:26] as well as the arrest of a Michigan man, after, police say, he asked people in a social media post to join him in hunting Palestinians. Now, that, unfortunately wasn't the only Islamophobic hate crime here in the United States. In fact, it wasn't the only one here in the Chicago area. [00:01:43] Spox, 32, reported that a 33 year old man is accused of spraying pepper spray during a protested skokie over the weekend. Zevulen Ebert is now facing aggravated battery and hate crime charges. Now, Corey Saylor, who's the research and advocacy director of the Council on American Islamic Relations, [00:02:01] made this statement, says public officials should do everything in their power to keep the wave of hate sweeping the nation right now from spiraling out of control. And, of course, that wave of hate sweeping the nation also includes a massive increase in anti-Semitic hate and anti-Semitic harassment, [00:02:20] as well as the Anti Defamation League reported. And as AP News wrote, the ADL Center on Extremism reported in a statement Wednesday that the organization recorded at least 312 reports of anti-Semitic acts between October 7th and October 23rd, [00:02:36] compared to 64 recorded excuse me during the same time period in 2022. Those reports included graffiti, slurs or non posting, as well as physical violence, such as a woman being punched in the face in New York by an attacker who the league said, you are Jewish. [00:02:53] And from a different report, there was a man dressed in traditionally Orthodox Jewish clothes in London who was assaulted by a man who targeted him based on his clothing. That man was arrested and also found to have a connection to a different [00:03:10] hate crime where he assaulted a interracial couple on the basis of there being interracially married together in public. Report continues on, the 312 reports included 109 anti-Israel sentiments [00:03:25] spoken or proclaimed at rallies. The Anti-Defamation League Center on Extremism found to be explicit or strong implicit support for Hamas and or violence against Jews in Israel, according to the statement. Lastly, protesters at several of the rallies use the slogan from the river to [00:03:42] the sea, Palestine will be free, which the Anti-Defamation League and other Jewish groups have criticized as a call to dismantle the state of Israel. Many Palestinian activists say they are not calling for the destruction of Israel, but for freedom of movement and equal rights and protections for Palestinians throughout the land. [00:03:58] And I'll say I have had a criticism of the ADL for a long time, that statements in support of Palestinian liberation are often categorized by the ADL as anti-Semitism, which I disagree with. I agree with the statements from the Palestinian activists that they're [00:04:14] not calling for the destruction of Israel, but freedom of movement. On that note, though, it should be easy for everybody to condemn instances of anti-Semitism, instances of Islamophobia that we have seen, beyond a shadow of a doubt, an increase of here in the United States. [00:04:31] We've seen the brutal murder of a child, we've seen the assaults of Jewish people in New York. That's not disputed whatsoever. And still there are people who are unwilling to call out this increase in hate, and that is disturbing. There are elected officials who aren't willing to listen to the concerns of these [00:04:50] communities. I live in a majority Muslim community, and people here are really scared. People here are really scared. My neighbors who are hijabi are afraid to go outside. I have a lot of friends who live in the majority Jewish community in Rogers Park. They're also scared, and they're feeling left behind by the government. [00:05:08] They're feeling completely ignored by the city of Chicago, especially when we've seen so many instances of hate crimes here in the Chicago area and the surrounding regions. People are terrified and there's been very little response by local, state, [00:05:23] and the federal government. We can't let what happened post 911 happen again. We can't let it happen to Jewish communities, we can't let it happen to Muslim communities, and we're already seeing this rise in hate. People need to be vigilant and call it out wherever they see it. >> Speaker 2: Yeah, I certainly agree with that. [00:05:41] As to your statement about the Anti-Defamation League counting pro Palestinian statements as acts of aggression towards the Jewish community, I would say if the phrase is historically one, the slogan is historically one that calls for and means. [00:06:00] Because words do have meaning still, the annihilation of the state of Israel and the full removal of Jews from that area maybe find a new slogan. Nazis can also rally and say, Jews will not replace us, and we mean just in our Christian club. [00:06:15] Or Nazis can rally and say, it's about white power, and then just say, no, we just mean power amongst ourselves. You could also just choose a different slogan and not use the one that stirs up anti-Semitism and hatred towards the Jewish community if you don't want it to be misinterpreted. [00:06:33] Because, again, words have power and phrases and slogans have history that I think needs to be respected if you don't want to amp up and light a fire under an already incredibly tinder box situation. That's also why I think it's so essential to be incredibly careful in the way we [00:06:50] cover these stories and the way that we present these issues. Because when there's a rush to judgment and nobody's excusing an overreaching, horribly aggressive response that kills too many civilians, innocent people in the Palestinian territories, of course. [00:07:10] But when this is presented as an issue of us versus them, of Jews versus Palestinians, that alone amps up so much hatred and brings up so much more anti-Semitism and Islamophobia. Because it creates this divide in our society, instead of what should be [00:07:28] a very obvious, non-controversial stance of all people across the world. Palestinians and Jews and all who aren't part of those groups, standing up against a terror organization that's been designated so by The US, by the European Union, by the UK, which is Hamas. [00:07:45] Who unfortunately is in charge in Gaza because they've been holding the Gazan people hostage ever since they took over in 2007 after Israel ended its formal occupation in 2005 and is withdrawn from those lands. [00:08:00] And it's an incredibly complex issue and people boil it down to divisive slogans, it creates more hate, as you reported. Almost a 100% increase in hate incidents against the Muslim community, [00:08:15] 388% rise against the Jewish community. And that's just here in the States, of course. There was the murder of the president of a synagogue here in the States just last week, and huge increases of anti-Semitic sentiments and feelings and crimes all over the United Kingdom and France and Europe and Latin America and North Africa. [00:08:35] London has reports of 1,300% increase against the Jewish community from the same time period last year, just the two and a half weeks since the terrorist attack that occurred. And so we really need to be careful. [00:08:52] We can speak against individual, horrible incidents. We can speak to protect innocent people. We can speak to protect innocent lives. But what we should not do is rush to judgment calling a country defending itself after a terrorist attack worse than 15, [00:09:09] 9, 11 genocide when they're responding. Let's be more responsible and more focused and talk specifically about let's minimize the loss of innocent life, while a country also, of course, as any nation does, has the right to defend itself. We must, if we're going to be responsible citizens, be much more responsible, [00:09:28] much more measured in the way that we respond to incidents like this. Because this is the social media war. I've never seen a conflict that seems to be so decided by social media. The way the parties are even acting on the ground seems affected by the sentiment around the world. [00:09:44] And we need to all be humans together and care about common humanity together, and try to protect innocent Palestinian life as much as we respect and care for and grieve for the loss of Jewish and Israeli life at the exact same time. [00:09:59] And make sure our words do not conflate those issues and don't make it us versus them when it should be. The world against a terrorist organization. >> Speaker 1: Now, I think that you and I have a fundamental disagreement on several points that you made, and I wish I had the time right now to go through, and [00:10:15] I wish that we had a longer form format that we can. >> Speaker 2: Hit me on a couple of them. Hit me on a couple. >> Speaker 1: All right, well, you said that it shouldn't be referred to as a genocide. I, however, am listening to and believe the statements of Rod Seagal, who is a Israeli historian and a Holocaust expert who wrote an article on [00:10:32] Jewish currents, who said that this is a textbook genocide. This is the displacement of a group of people, the forcible displacement of a group of people under threat of a bombing campaign, under the threat of a ground invasion, saying that they need to go in and [00:10:48] root out Hamas, but they all need to remove them. They all need to be transferred to the south of Gaza, where, by the way, they are still continuing to be bombed in the south of Gaza, the place they were told to evacuate to. He classified that as a textbook case of genocide. [00:11:03] And again, this is not a radical agent of Hamas. This is an Israeli historian. This is an expert on the Holocaust who said this in Jewish current. That's one thing. I already explained I disagree with the characterization of the statement, [00:11:20] from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free. Again, it's not necessarily the best format for us to go back and forth. We do have to go to a break right, right now. But I'll let you respond. Of course I'll let you respond. >> Speaker 2: Let me just respond to that quickly. [00:11:36] There's also the son of the founder of Hamas, who that Hamas is a terrible terrorist organization that needs to be taken out and is speaking forcefully in support of what Israel is doing. And again, it doesn't, with all respect, matter what your [00:11:54] opinion is of a phrase that has been historically used to stand for the eradication of the Jewish homeland. That's what it stands for. You can't repurpose hate slogans and say, well, the words themselves don't mean that. [00:12:09] Yeah, maybe parsed separately, but you can write a different rhyme if you want to just support the Palestinian people. It doesn't need to be one that gins up hate and the calling for the annihilation of an entire group of people from the homeland the one homeland they're supposed [00:12:25] to have safe in this world, like any other nationality gets to have in this planet. And instead of being a safe haven, it's one where terrorist attacks have happened over and over and over again. So this one person, this one Jewish person, declares it to be a genocide. [00:12:42] Also, there was a speech at the House of Lords yesterday where one of the lords in the UK government specifically made a very perfect case about how this is well within Israel's rights. And again, I'm no advocate for the horrible loss of innocent life, but [00:12:58] proportionality does not need to mean you only are allowed to harm the same number of citizens it's about to proportionality with the goal of the military objective. Which is stated, in which the whole world generally is behind, [00:13:13] is the eradication of Hamas. As far as the governments of the world, at least the Western world, ones that share our values, is to not prop up a terrorist organization that is trying to literally eradicate people. And so we all want peace, but peace can't be found if you don't have a partner for [00:13:28] peace, and they are instead using terror tactics to kill people. And again, for the millionth time, I am not in support of the horrible loss of innocent life. But it's an incredibly difficult predicament because Israel either tells [00:13:44] them to stay and then Hamas uses them as human shields and puts all of their munitions and their soldiers in heavily populated areas and more people die. Or they warn them and say, Please, not displacing them forever, please leave to the south while we have an incursion to try to get rid [00:14:01] of the group that's also holding them hostage. And then that's a problem, too. I have not seen reports of continued bombing in the south. I don't believe that to be true. I'm sure there have been errant missiles that have landed incorrectly. There is not a heavy bombardment of bombs hitting the south where people are being [00:14:19] told to evacuate to. And so there needs to be some way that we don't continually pit this as us versus them, but instead just can unite against the terror organization. I'm sure, Ray, you don't argue that Hamas is not a terror organization and [00:14:36] is certainly not a partner for peace with the Israeli people, do you? >> Speaker 1: No, obviously, I wouldn't say that. Hamas is a terrorist organization, but I think that to put it into the context of the far right Israeli government, which has continued to support Hamas with the explicit goal of preventing [00:14:52] the establishment of a Palestinian state, it's important to put it in that context. >> Speaker 2: 100%. Agree on that, 100%. And that's what happened. I disagree with it because Netanyahu did that to stop a two state solution, which is disgusting, and he needs to go, and he should not be the leader of Israel, [00:15:10] which is also a big part of why Israeli people have been protesting against him. But at the exact same time, when you try to work with the leadership of Hamas, this is what happens when even working with them. So it's quite clear they are not a partner for peace. [00:15:25] When you prop them up, give them money and try to make them more legitimized, and they go and slaughter your people in a horrific terrorist attack. Obviously, there needs to be a response, and we all wish that response could be better, but there still has to be change, and I don't know a better way to do it. [00:15:42] And if you can suggest one, I would love to hear it. But if not, we're stuck between a rock and a hard place and the oldest conflict and most complex conflict maybe in human history.